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	<title>Comments on: Understanding the ‘Core’ of the Gospel: a Quick personal statement</title>
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	<link>http://regenerationayk.wordpress.com/2007/02/27/understanding-the-%e2%80%98core%e2%80%99-of-the-gospel-a-quick-personal-statement/</link>
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		<title>By: Heretic</title>
		<link>http://regenerationayk.wordpress.com/2007/02/27/understanding-the-%e2%80%98core%e2%80%99-of-the-gospel-a-quick-personal-statement/#comment-317</link>
		<dc:creator>Heretic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Feb 2007 19:33:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://regenerationayk.wordpress.com/2007/02/27/understanding-the-%e2%80%98core%e2%80%99-of-the-gospel-a-quick-personal-statement/#comment-317</guid>
		<description>NAyK-

I am not judging Newbigin.  Just commenting on your article and the ideas expressed.  However, I think we misquote &quot;Judge not.&quot;

Maybe our points of view are not too far removed, and I reconsidered my comments before posting them, after re-reading your post again.  

I say that the primary purpose Jesus came was for the glory of the father, because God cannot place more importance or weight on something other than Himself.  Is this not the very definition of idolatry?  To elevate one&#039;s worth above God Himself?  Is that not the message that we portray, that God values men above His own self?  Wouldn&#039;t he then be guilty of idolatry?

I would not disagree that we place more importance on by-laws then we do the law of God.  Western missionaries have failed many times, because they presented a &quot;western religion and Jesus.&quot;  Jesus transcends every culture and time.  Why?  Because He is not concerned with the glory of man.  He is consumed by the glory of the father.

I like some of your thoughts.  Trying to communicat in the blog world sometimes leaves a lot to be desired.

PS - Never made it to Bangalore, but spent 2 weeks in Varanasi (Baranas) and then 2 weeks in Kathmandu.  These 4 weeks were the highlights of my trip!

Blessings my friend!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>NAyK-</p>
<p>I am not judging Newbigin.  Just commenting on your article and the ideas expressed.  However, I think we misquote &#8220;Judge not.&#8221;</p>
<p>Maybe our points of view are not too far removed, and I reconsidered my comments before posting them, after re-reading your post again.  </p>
<p>I say that the primary purpose Jesus came was for the glory of the father, because God cannot place more importance or weight on something other than Himself.  Is this not the very definition of idolatry?  To elevate one&#8217;s worth above God Himself?  Is that not the message that we portray, that God values men above His own self?  Wouldn&#8217;t he then be guilty of idolatry?</p>
<p>I would not disagree that we place more importance on by-laws then we do the law of God.  Western missionaries have failed many times, because they presented a &#8220;western religion and Jesus.&#8221;  Jesus transcends every culture and time.  Why?  Because He is not concerned with the glory of man.  He is consumed by the glory of the father.</p>
<p>I like some of your thoughts.  Trying to communicat in the blog world sometimes leaves a lot to be desired.</p>
<p>PS &#8211; Never made it to Bangalore, but spent 2 weeks in Varanasi (Baranas) and then 2 weeks in Kathmandu.  These 4 weeks were the highlights of my trip!</p>
<p>Blessings my friend!</p>
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		<title>By: NAyK</title>
		<link>http://regenerationayk.wordpress.com/2007/02/27/understanding-the-%e2%80%98core%e2%80%99-of-the-gospel-a-quick-personal-statement/#comment-316</link>
		<dc:creator>NAyK</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Feb 2007 18:57:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://regenerationayk.wordpress.com/2007/02/27/understanding-the-%e2%80%98core%e2%80%99-of-the-gospel-a-quick-personal-statement/#comment-316</guid>
		<description>Hey &#039;heretic&#039; thanks for your comments. 

Newbigin&#039;s thesis flawed? Hmm. I hope you&#039;re not judging Newbigin on the basis of my comments on him (ie. I&#039;m just taking a phrase out of his chapter).  If you have read Newbigin, then I guess you&#039;re aware that he&#039;s basically arguing about what do you &#039;translate&#039; to other cultures. Meaning; usually missionaries, going into a culture, bring a &#039;message&#039; of the gospel. Newbigin argues that these &#039;message of the gospel&#039; or even &#039;core&#039; message of the gospel are all culturally conditioned. 

For instance, if I was to apply this argument to your own comment, I could argue that your identification of the &quot;primary&quot; purpose of Jesus coming on earth as bringing &quot;glory to the father&quot; comes out of prioritizing (taking) one text above other texts. For instance, you have inadvertently put Matthew 20:28 and Mark 10:45 as secondary meanings of Jesus&#039; purpose of coming. The argument would be that your reasoning is not necessarily universal, but conditioned by your teachers, or your context. In another place, a Christian may look at Mark 10:45 and could possibly highlight Jesus&#039; purpose of coming to &quot;serve&quot;. 

Now we could go on and on about whether this is the same thing or not; but the point is that there has been no consistent &#039;core&#039; teaching of the Bible (doctrines) that have been identified for all people for all time. We usually have linguistically-confined (culturally conditioned) versions of one doctrine or another... (usually along the a range of issues). And while there is a similarity, there is never an exact-sameness with one theology with another. 

Hence, returning to the subject at hand, Newbigin urges Missionaries to avoid thinking about a &#039;core&#039; gospel that is then contextualisation, but rather believes that the &#039;core&#039; is Jesus himself who is able to live and act among the people. Once we believe that it is Jesus himself who is able to impact and challenge a local Christian community, the missionary can be a dialogue partner, but is not needed as sole provider of theology. 

I therefore don&#039;t think that Newbigin&#039;s thesis is false... especially in view of his context for identification of &#039;core&#039; teaching for communicating across cultures. 

ps. I currently live in Bangalore (South India). Though my deepest affinity is in the Foothills of the Himalayas in Northern India, in a small town called Mussoorie.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey &#8216;heretic&#8217; thanks for your comments. </p>
<p>Newbigin&#8217;s thesis flawed? Hmm. I hope you&#8217;re not judging Newbigin on the basis of my comments on him (ie. I&#8217;m just taking a phrase out of his chapter).  If you have read Newbigin, then I guess you&#8217;re aware that he&#8217;s basically arguing about what do you &#8216;translate&#8217; to other cultures. Meaning; usually missionaries, going into a culture, bring a &#8216;message&#8217; of the gospel. Newbigin argues that these &#8216;message of the gospel&#8217; or even &#8216;core&#8217; message of the gospel are all culturally conditioned. </p>
<p>For instance, if I was to apply this argument to your own comment, I could argue that your identification of the &#8220;primary&#8221; purpose of Jesus coming on earth as bringing &#8220;glory to the father&#8221; comes out of prioritizing (taking) one text above other texts. For instance, you have inadvertently put Matthew 20:28 and Mark 10:45 as secondary meanings of Jesus&#8217; purpose of coming. The argument would be that your reasoning is not necessarily universal, but conditioned by your teachers, or your context. In another place, a Christian may look at Mark 10:45 and could possibly highlight Jesus&#8217; purpose of coming to &#8220;serve&#8221;. </p>
<p>Now we could go on and on about whether this is the same thing or not; but the point is that there has been no consistent &#8216;core&#8217; teaching of the Bible (doctrines) that have been identified for all people for all time. We usually have linguistically-confined (culturally conditioned) versions of one doctrine or another&#8230; (usually along the a range of issues). And while there is a similarity, there is never an exact-sameness with one theology with another. </p>
<p>Hence, returning to the subject at hand, Newbigin urges Missionaries to avoid thinking about a &#8216;core&#8217; gospel that is then contextualisation, but rather believes that the &#8216;core&#8217; is Jesus himself who is able to live and act among the people. Once we believe that it is Jesus himself who is able to impact and challenge a local Christian community, the missionary can be a dialogue partner, but is not needed as sole provider of theology. </p>
<p>I therefore don&#8217;t think that Newbigin&#8217;s thesis is false&#8230; especially in view of his context for identification of &#8216;core&#8217; teaching for communicating across cultures. </p>
<p>ps. I currently live in Bangalore (South India). Though my deepest affinity is in the Foothills of the Himalayas in Northern India, in a small town called Mussoorie.</p>
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		<title>By: Heretic</title>
		<link>http://regenerationayk.wordpress.com/2007/02/27/understanding-the-%e2%80%98core%e2%80%99-of-the-gospel-a-quick-personal-statement/#comment-315</link>
		<dc:creator>Heretic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Feb 2007 17:18:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://regenerationayk.wordpress.com/2007/02/27/understanding-the-%e2%80%98core%e2%80%99-of-the-gospel-a-quick-personal-statement/#comment-315</guid>
		<description>I think Newbigin&#039;s thesis is somewhat flawed, and here is why.  

The Bible is His Story.  It is not man&#039;s story.  It is the story of an almighty God.  Everything exists for His glory.  The &quot;stories&quot; are &quot;HisStory&quot; of trying to establish His government among men.

The gospel message or good news that Jesus preached was that the Kingdom (of God) had come.  The primary purpose Jesus came was to bring glory to the father.

As men, we think we were the primary purpose, and that is beginning on a false premise.  We were not the primary purpose, but a secondary purpose.

The &quot;core&quot; is universal to all men everywhere and it is simply this:  the Good News is that Jesus came that you might have life.  To lead you from the kingdom of darkness into the Kingdom of Light.  You can&#039;t get there by road or map.  It is your belief that Christ was the door.

Side Note:  What part of India are you from?  I spent 6 months there, and would love to go back one day!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think Newbigin&#8217;s thesis is somewhat flawed, and here is why.  </p>
<p>The Bible is His Story.  It is not man&#8217;s story.  It is the story of an almighty God.  Everything exists for His glory.  The &#8220;stories&#8221; are &#8220;HisStory&#8221; of trying to establish His government among men.</p>
<p>The gospel message or good news that Jesus preached was that the Kingdom (of God) had come.  The primary purpose Jesus came was to bring glory to the father.</p>
<p>As men, we think we were the primary purpose, and that is beginning on a false premise.  We were not the primary purpose, but a secondary purpose.</p>
<p>The &#8220;core&#8221; is universal to all men everywhere and it is simply this:  the Good News is that Jesus came that you might have life.  To lead you from the kingdom of darkness into the Kingdom of Light.  You can&#8217;t get there by road or map.  It is your belief that Christ was the door.</p>
<p>Side Note:  What part of India are you from?  I spent 6 months there, and would love to go back one day!</p>
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